|By Alex Carson||By 12-04-2012|
|1. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 11:17:53|
No lose situation for both Bay and the Mariners. There is a lot of incentive for Jason to want to do well in front of family and friends. Seattle had a need for a power-hitting outfielder. The Mets have paid his salary. Zero risk for the Mariners.
|2. By: Jason A. Churchill on 12-04-2012 11:22:16|
I think there is one risk -- making the average Mariners fan believe that the club sees Bay as a "big bat."
|3. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 11:24:31|
Honestly, Alex, I don't think anyone believes Bay is going to displace anyone. He'll come in and compete for a job. If he wins it, I'm good with it.
As for Casper Wells, he needs to do the same thing. He should be assured nothing. He hasn't developed any consistancy in his ML career. So, let him earn a spot on the roster.
|4. By: hankshim on 12-04-2012 11:25:14|
as long as we don't let him sit on our bench if he's not hitting when we can have one of the younger guys out there getting AB's, that's fine. cheap, local signing. sounds about right for the M's.
|5. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 11:25:49|
You can't fix the naive, Jason. And I doubt that they will try to sell Bay as anything more than a guy coming to camp trying to prove he still has some nitro in the tank.
|6. By: maqman on 12-04-2012 11:31:01|
I think there are several players who should be aware that they have to show they are major leaguers if they want to to stay in The Show. Bay's worth a look in spring training, given the Mets looked on him as we did Figgins, I wouldn't get your hopes up.
|7. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 11:38:00|
What hopes? He shows he can still play, Seattle has openings. He doesn't, he's somewhere else. Hope is for those who believe in Roy Hobbs.
|8. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 12:31:40|
Why do people assume that the M's meeting the D-backs was about Upton, and not Kubel? I guess if there isn't a good Upton rumor, that the day is incomplete.
Imagine if Upton was in Seattle. It would be a daily, "Seattle should trade Felix...." or "Seattle should trade Upton...." rumor. I guess bad press is still good press.....LOL.
|9. By: Tackeret on 12-04-2012 12:36:08|
I love this time of year...rumors flying around left and right. I had to share this one, since most of the site we all follow seemed to dislike the idea of trading for Garrett Jones of the Pirates, especially if 'we' had to send Smoak and Noesi and Jaso to the Pirates. Just say this over on MLBtraderumors:
The Pirates made an attempt to land pitching prospect Taijuan Walker in a deal for Garrett Jones, but were rebuffed by the Mariners, according to Rob Biertempfel of the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review.
Just a chuckle for your Tuesday
|10. By: Paul Martin on 12-04-2012 12:42:11|
Jason Bay does nothing for me and I doubt he makes the team out of spring training. I would rather have Casper Wells as my 4th outfielder, and if you think Bay is anything more than a 4th outfielder you are crazy. I realize it doesn't cost us anything to give him a look in spring training, but the team better either sign or trade for another outfielder (or two more because who knows how many games Gutierrez will play).
I am trying to be patient Jack, but the clock is still ticking, and in my mind you haven't done anything yet. This move might feel good to bring home the local kid, but it doesn't count!
|11. By: rocketdawg31 on 12-04-2012 12:58:35|
As for Casper Wells, he needs to do the same thing. He should be assured nothing. He hasn't developed any consistancy in his ML career.
Fundamentally, I'd agree, Edman...but with one fairly big caveat.
Casper Wells keeps getting yoinked by Wedge out of the lineup every time he's in something that's starting to resemble a slump.
The guy has not had, in my opinion, a full, fair shot YET with us.
I really don't know if he's regular, every day timber for a major league team- there are numbers on him that say 'yea' and others 'nay'.
But I'd sure like him to at least get something like the shot Justin Smoak has gotten.
|12. By: Rampageoholics on 12-04-2012 13:00:04|
#9 I saw that rumor too...just amazing if that was actually offered. I find it tough to believe that other clubs place so little value on prospects, but if that's actually the case then if I were jack I wouldn't trade any of my prospects. Instead I would look to add someone like @JonHeymanCBS: #mariners are now meeting with michael bourn's agent scott boras, says @DKnobler.
|13. By: Rampageoholics on 12-04-2012 13:04:04|
...as a free agent. I would love to see Bourn, Gutierrez, and Saunders in the OF together. Also, he would give us a legit leadoff guy that actually gets on base and allow Ackley to slot into what I view as his natural slot, the two hole.
|14. By: Alex Carson on 12-04-2012 13:04:55|
I tend to agree with rocketdawg31. It sure seems as if Wells' leash is extremely short with Wedge, whereas guys like Carlos Peguero have had long stretches of suck before being replaced.
Why? No clue. Wedge may just not like something about his game. Or, it could just be a small sample hill we're making a mountain out of.
|15. By: dewey on 12-04-2012 13:20:26|
The other bad thing he will be getting at bats that the kids arent gonna get because he is there.Its just like when someone signs Figgins and hopes he recovers and there kids dont get to play in spring training games is what i see,
|16. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 13:58:40|
Rocketdawg, that's simply excuse making for Wells. If he had come in and played well on a consistant basis, the job would be his. But, what I saw was a guy who went to Tacoma, fixed his swing a little bit, then started trending back into bad habits. It's not Wedge's fault that he was unreliable at the plate. It's not up to Wedge to give him more attempts to prove he deserves a bigger role, it's up to him to prove that he does. If he does as Saunders did in the off-season, then he'll have no problem earning extra time. If he doesn't, then he's in competition with every other outfielder, Bay or not.
dewey, you're putting the cart in front of the horse. What kids in the outfield is he blocking? Do we have any great outfield prospect at AAA that I'm not aware of?
At this moment in time, Bay would be another guy trying to earn a job. That is not bad in any way, unless you let overactive imaginations see the worse possible scenarios.
|17. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 14:01:28|
Some seem to forget. It is not the job of the Major League club to give yound players opportunities. It's their job to put the players on the field, that give them the best opportunity to win. Yes, you have to factor in young players, but you don't have to afford them all with at bat opportunities, unless they're ready to compete at the ML level.
|18. By: iheartfelix on 12-04-2012 14:01:42|
Even letting Bay compete with Wells for the 4th outfielder spot is scary to me, given Wedge's love of preseason stats...
|19. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 14:09:01|
So, you think Wedge should base his decisions on speculation? Is he suppose to know which non-performers in Spring Training are really masking hidden abilities?
So just how would you propose he make choices?
|20. By: jgthompson21 on 12-04-2012 15:08:41|
Does anyone on here really read and listen to edman? Im new here and he sounds like an annoying know it all
|21. By: rjfrik on 12-04-2012 15:16:29|
What you didn't know this is Edman's site? He's partners with Jason. Jason does the articles and Edman takes over the threads.
Edman knows all. Edman knows all.
|22. By: rjfrik on 12-04-2012 15:18:31|
Jason Bay is a turd. He won't make the team. He's a roster invite to spring break, where he will show that he's a turd. Not too worried about Bay taking a spot.
And speaking of turds we might as well label Wedge one as well. Biggest turd manager there is. I can't wait till the guy is fired. Hopefully after this next year.
|23. By: DUWORKSON on 12-04-2012 15:22:03|
So with all these FA linked to the organization I wonder if the JZ can make a huge splash during the off-season?
If the orgainzation approach is "ALL-IN" on upgrading the offense then signing both Micheal Bourn and Josh Hamilton makes alot of sense.
Josh Hamilton been rumored to have an offer for a four year contract from the Rangers. Hamilton is the best FA offense player avialbe. IMO the M's can add an addition year to that contract five years for 125 million should get it done.
Micheal Bourn would look really good as our leadoff hitter. A contract similar to Upton should also get the job done. Signing Bourn would make Guti expendable.
Sticking with "ALL-IN" theme the organizations been pretty clear that they covet Butler. A trade that sent James Paxton Hector Nosi and Justin Smoak to KC for Butler. That should get the deal done.
That should upgrade the offese alot without givig up our two stud pitcher Walker and Hultzen.
|24. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 16:04:46|
jgthompson, what have I said that is untrue? When people post nonsense, I'll respond to it. There are many annoying know-it-all's here. And that is because we all have opinions. Don't like them, then ignore and post your own. But taking cheapshot at posters, is childish. You're free to not read anything you want, I didn't force you.
rjfrik, take note of the cheapshot comment.
|25. By: d2ret on 12-04-2012 16:34:09|
A three way with the Tribe and Dbacks makes a lot of sense:
Ms get: Upton
Tribe gets: Paxton, Maurer + +
D backs get: A. Cabrera
|26. By: Paul Martin on 12-04-2012 16:36:02|
@23 I would love to sign Hamilton and Bourn too, but there is zero chance of this happening. Seattle just isn't willing to take on that much payroll. I would be shocked if they sign Hamilton, Bourn, or Swisher (all huge upgrades over what they have now). They signed the local kid Bay, will sign a couple smaller fringe free agents, and have about a 50% chance of making a significant trade (not for lack of effort, it's just other teams don't value our prospects as much as we do and over value their own).
I think the biggest move they make will be re-signing Felix Hernandez.
|27. By: rocketdawg31 on 12-04-2012 16:42:33|
Rocketdawg, that's simply excuse making for Wells. If he had come in and played well on a consistant (sic) basis, the job would be his.
That's bunk, and directly counter to what I was saying, Edman.
"Consistent basis" requires consistent at-bats. You know how much failure is in this game. So, according to you, he's got to go something like 30-for-75- right out of the gate- in order to prove his worth to anyone?
I'm not making excuses for anyone. If you'd bothered to read my whole post, you'd've noticed that I DID put in the fact that I don't know for sure whether Wells is a good enough player (or ever will be) to be a regular. I'm not up in here saying that he should be, absolutely. I am saying that he should at least get something like 400 ABs as a decent audition, without the knowledge that an 0-for-7 is going to make sure that he doesn't see the field again for a week.
He's had less than 400 ABs as a Mariner (spread out over two seasons), and less than 600 in the major leagues overall.
There was that one injury from a Brandon Morrow fastball, sure. Wedge can't be faulted for that vertigo he went through. Them's the breaks. But I wouldn't exactly say that a healthy Wells has gotten every bit the chance than an Ackley has, a Smoak has, a Seager has.
I think you're off the mark by even mentioning the quality "consistent". Casper Wells hasn't gotten a clear-cut opportunity to show consistent or inconsistent results because Wedge finds him a seat as soon as he has an 0-for-4 game or an 0-for-7 streak.
In other words, as of right now, Wells has been Living Small Sample Size Theater.
But, what I saw was a guy who went to Tacoma, fixed his swing a little bit, then started trending back into bad habits.
Bad habits require time and ABs to break for a young player. He's never going to get better on the bench for huge chunks of games at a time.
It's not Wedge's fault that he was unreliable at the plate. Yes it is. By not giving him a platform to prove any reliability in the first place.
It's not up to Wedge to give him more attempts to prove he deserves a bigger role, it's up to him to prove that he does. If he does as Saunders did in the off-season, then he'll have no problem earning extra time. If he doesn't, then he's in competition with every other outfielder, Bay or not.
Agreed on this last part. I guess we'll have to agree to DISagree on the rest of it.
|28. By: Edman on 12-04-2012 17:03:52|
Sorry rocketdawg if I cam on too strong. I see Wells in the same position Saunders was in. When you fall behind the rest of the class, you have to work even harder to earn back your credibility. There are only so many at bats to go around. And, I'm not saying Wells needs to hit .400. More than anything, he has to show improvement.
It's too bad that Morrow hitting him pushed him back. He was playing very well, up to that point. How much that affected him, nobody really knows.
I hope he does do a Saunders next season. And, I think he's capable. But, Jason Bay being in Seattle won't have anything to do with it. If anything, he'll have more incentive to work harder.
I see some overreacting to Bay. He's a non-factor. But, he is worth a look. If he could do a Josh Willingham in Seattle, wouldn't Seattle be stupid not to find out if he could?
|29. By: rocketdawg31 on 12-04-2012 18:55:53|
I'd completely agree that a look at Jason Bay is a zero-risk, medium-reward proposition. And that Seattle should absolutely do it.
A team looking for talent as much as the Mariners are should turn over EVERY stone they can find.
The chances of Bay becoming some facsimile of what he was in a M's uni are pretty small...but if he could, hey. It's all grins, and welcome to the team for one more year in the sun.
|30. By: Perry Noid on 12-04-2012 22:54:09|
The cost to the M's would be cheap. The Mets were so desperate to get rid of him that they restructured his contract before tossing him overboard. Bay will have checks rolling in from the east coast while he's paid only the league minimum by his new employer.
|31. By: Sjb5524 on 12-05-2012 08:12:06|
IMO Jack already screwed up...
Should've could've picked up the Melk Man, and Russell, both were had for reasonable good contracts. And then traded Vargas for Span. We would hv been set and ready with the Bat=Melky, the lead off center fielder = Span, and the Catcher to hold over until Z is ready = Russell.
Who out there would not hv been excited with these additions and not giving up any of the top prospects, and still waiting for Smoaks, Ackley, Seager, and Montero to all develop. IMO it's still way to early to give up on any of them....
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